We’ve avoided DocuSign because ZipForms was so terrible in the Mac world. While the new implementation is not great, it’s better. And as kludgey and expensive as DocuSign seems, I really, really want electronic signatures.
But I have questions:
1. Can I use DocuSign to do my “broker oversight” signatures? That’s not a legal question. I’m just asking, is it possible?
2. If I receive a document — say a counter-offer — from another DocuSign-using Realtor, can I use DocuSign to get my client’s signature on that document?
3. Same question, but just an ordinary PDF? How about an ordinary fax?
4. What about added documents? We do a lot in the way of extended additional clauses, especially on listings, with each version of those clauses being unique. Is it possible to add our own forms in a DocuSign envelope?
5. What do you love about DocuSign?
6. What do you hate about it?
I’m grateful for any insights you can offer.
Eric Bramlett says:
Funny you wrote this today. I signed up for docusign on Friday to get a sig from a client who was having a tough time finding a fax machine (a common problem and I just finally decided it was time.)
I’m curious to know the answers to your questions, as well. I’ll play with it some and see if I can get answers.
July 12, 2009 — 9:07 am
Greg Swann says:
Eric just sold me on the product. I’m still very interested in the answers to my questions, but Eric sent me a fax of an old document that he had marked up for signatures. I was able to shoot it back to him with no hassle whatever.
I have a deal live now where one buyer is in Phoenix, with two more out of state. The two out of state went to Israel for vacation just as we got to the signing part of the party. DocuSign would have paid for itself in hassle-elimination on that one job.
July 12, 2009 — 9:25 am
Benjamin Ficker says:
I had docusign up in Portland, but the problem was always getting the agent on the other side on board. They were stuck in their old ways and insist on wet sigs.
When I moved down here, I asked about using it. I was told that it wouldn’t fly down here, especially with banks involved with short sales and reo’s. Please tell me I’m mistaken…
July 12, 2009 — 10:03 am
Greg Swann says:
I just asked a lister with dozens of REOs in play. He says electronic signatures are not a problem.
I also talked to a lister on an owner-owned home we have in negotiations — it was she who got me thinking about DocuSign today — and she said it’s saving her hours of driving around time every week.
I want everything I want, but we’re getting this regardless.
July 12, 2009 — 10:52 am
TG says:
Hi folks:
Great post with some great questions! I am from DocuSign so I thought I’d take a crack at some answers below. I hope these help. If you have more questions, please post them in the DocuSign forum also – it is a great source of ‘how do I?’…
1. Can I use DocuSign to do my “broker oversight” signatures? That’s not a legal question. I’m just asking, is it possible?
[TG] – I would need more info on this but DocuSign can be used to sign any document that can be printed. Customers in every industry have used DocuSign to sign over 30 million transactions – loan mods, Real Estate transactions, sales contracts, in the US and worldwide.
2. If I receive a document — say a counter-offer — from another DocuSign-using Realtor, can I use DocuSign to get my client’s signature on that document?
[TG} – Yes. The answer depends on the workflow the other Realtor used, but if they were to ‘CC’ you on the transaction, DocuSign will get you that document the second the last signer signs, and you can take that document and create a new envelope with it, adding your signers, and cc’ing the other agent so they will get the final signed copy when it is done. You can also just take the document if the other realtor sends you a copy in an email, but that is not as fast or automatic.
3. Same question, but just an ordinary PDF? How about an ordinary fax?
[TG] – yes. DocuSign can load any document that can be printed via the print driver, and you can load most file types directly by using the ‘upload’ function.
4. What about added documents? We do a lot in the way of extended additional clauses, especially on listings, with each version of those clauses being unique. Is it possible to add our own forms in a DocuSign envelope?
[TG] – Yes. you can add your own documents from other locations after you add your zipform documents. Simply start your envelope with zipform, then select documents and load more. If you have the print client (windows only) you can also print more documents into that same envelope.
5. What do you love about DocuSign?
[TG] it is a great place to work, and I really enjoy solving problems for customers. For example, this post started by saying DocuSign could be improved. I am very curious to hear what we can do to make this a better product for you.
6. What do you hate about it?
[TG] The whole world does not use it yet. People still make me send faxes which are inherently not secure and a real pain to deal with.
As far as s the comment about expensive goes, I am not sure I get it. DocuSign costs from $.45 per day to $1.15 per day depending on your version. However user surveys indicate DocuSign saves the average realtor about 6 hours per week – nearly an entire day. No more babysitting the fax machine, no more making customers find fax machines to sign, huge customer satisfaction increase. So for transactions that may be worth thousands of dollars in commission, spending less than a buck to ensure it goes smoothly does not seem expensive. What am I missing?
-TG
July 12, 2009 — 11:38 am
Greg Swann says:
TG: Do you get paid by commission? If so, tell us how to make sure you get paid for your efforts here.
July 12, 2009 — 11:53 am
Eric Bramlett says:
What do you guys know about wet signatures for one side of the transaction and docusign on the other side? Will that fly? If so, I’m never getting a wet sig again.
July 12, 2009 — 11:44 am
Greg Swann says:
> What do you guys know about wet signatures for one side of the transaction and docusign on the other side?
I think what you did with me is exactly that. We receive faxes as PDFs (MetroFax.com). From TG’s comment, it sounds like you could just re-envelope a fax and shoot if off to your client, then flip the DocuSigned version back to the originating party. I’m with you. This is the way to do everything. CC to your iPhone, and you have what you need for everyone.
July 12, 2009 — 11:52 am
Rob Thiessen says:
Greg…
I am the office hero since last year when I found Docusign by way of a comment made by Kevin Boer on BHB https://www.bloodhoundrealty.com/BloodhoundBlog/?p=2259#comments
1. I don’t know what broker oversight signatures are but basically you can now upload almost any document format into the Docusign envelope that will be converted to PDF. Secondary documents required to be added to say a purchase agreement can easily be uploaded as well.
2. Yes you can. You will typically get that offer via pdf. Save it locally then upload, tag for sigs then send back.
3. Yes, yes. Scan faxes or other hard copies to pdf, then tag. I have internet fax so all of those are delivered in pdf.
4. yes
5. I love how one spouse is in New York and the other is in China. Then after they sign, miraculously both of their signatures are merged onto the one document…. freaking amazing…no FEDEX or UPS overnighting docs ever again. Since Docusign did an update, now I can take my real signature and upload it to be used on all of my signings.
6. You have to be very careful in placing initials or sigs above on another. If they are too close they ride over one another.
One other thing I have not tried yet… Templates. I have to upgrade my account but having the sig/inital tabs auto placed has got to be the best feature ever! If we could just get Title/Escrow, Lenders on board it would be terrific.
July 12, 2009 — 11:49 am
Rob Thiessen says:
Eric,
Wet on one side, Docusign on the other no problems here. Not all parties are required to have docusign.
Please recruit other agents to sign up, I have and they think I am a god…well pretty much a god.
July 12, 2009 — 11:53 am
Rob Thiessen says:
TG- Thanks for the tip about ccing… that will save me time!
July 12, 2009 — 11:57 am
Kris Berg says:
I’m the biggest Docusign fan on the planet. My 2 cents:
1. Yes
2. Yes
3. Yes
4. Yes
5. Increased productivity, lower business costs,clients LOVE it! Try setting up templates for your disclosures and having your clients fill them out on-line — very cool.
6. Templates are fussy to set up, but worth it. Also, if the client forgets his password, it can be a bit of an ordeal.
My biggest problem so far is the hold-out lenders that refuse to accept anything but “wet” signatures (too busy shaving the corners off of blocks to make wheels). So, occassionally, an otherwise awesome time saving and green process becomes an adventure in “Let’s do everything twice.”
July 12, 2009 — 12:08 pm
Eric Bramlett says:
TG –
Do you guys offer affiliate links? I’ll proudly pimp this product. I signed up on Friday, have used it for one transaction, and compare it to my GPS (How did I get along without it?)
July 12, 2009 — 12:18 pm
An Bui says:
Wow, quite the conversation! Thanks for kicking it off, Greg, & thanks to Kris, Rob and everyone else for contributing.
TG is absolutely right. DocuSign is VERY interested in user feedback so we can build a better product for our users! The DocuSign forums also has a ‘wishlist’ area in addition to the ‘how do I…’. The link is http://www.DocuSign.com/forums and we have a bunch of folks answering questions!
For those of you in the Phoenix area, I’ll be in the area in Sept – a bunch of us are planning a tweetup & I’d love to see you there! Let me know via Twitter (@DocuSign) if you’re interested
July 12, 2009 — 1:12 pm
Don Reedy says:
TG- Kudos. Impressive, to the point answers. More info on you, contact, etc., and will do and send business.
July 12, 2009 — 1:24 pm
TG says:
Hi Don/Folks:
Thanks for the excellent thread! Thanks also to Greg for the questions. As my post said, I am ‘from’ DocuSign – actually I am the founder. I run Product Strategy and am always looking for input about how we can improve the service. We added quite a bit of capability in the last year, and we are looking at usability now.
I can be found at http://twitter.com/tgonser and my first name @docusign.com
-Tom [TG]
July 12, 2009 — 1:49 pm
Ryan hartman says:
I love it too. Been using for a few years. Only beef is that you’ll occassionally set up a 20 + page doc, send , and realize you’ve left something out. Maybe I’m missing some functionality, but it seems you have to go back and redo the whole doc (sometimes with 50 or more labels if we’re talking multiple parties… Not trying to complain though, ds is bombdiggity –just seems like an ok place to make a real estate friendly feature request….maybe revision histories pre signature…
July 12, 2009 — 3:17 pm
TG says:
Ryan –
Two things to keep in mind:
1. You can at any time, save your envelope as a ‘draft’. Then come back later and add documents, tags, users, etc.
2. If you have advanced, you can create templates that apply everything – tabs, workflow, etc. – to documents you load into the envelope.
Templates are great if you send the same document over and over. For example, a purchase agreement. Make a template for your purchase agreement, then the next time you send a purchase agreement, IDR will apply everything for you – ALL the tabs, the subject, email, etc. You just need to translate the roles in the template to users. Makes a 10 min job into a 1 minute job, and you can’t make mistakes anymore!
-TG
July 12, 2009 — 6:54 pm
Russell Shaw says:
We have used it since it became available and my staff in the contract and escrow area LOVE it. There are a few lenders (ASC, Wells Fargo & EMC) who won’t allow Docusign but pretty much everyone else does. A very cool product.
July 12, 2009 — 9:02 pm
Karla Parker says:
There has to be a better than Docu Sign though. Where is the solution that does not require a PDF? Are they the only game in town. It’s always nice to have options. It promotes competition and progress. There are solutions in other industries that don’t require the whole download. Each signer signs from a web based password secured website. Clean, easy, done.
July 12, 2009 — 10:01 pm
TG says:
Just to be clear DocuSign does not require a PDF. Any document can be either printed or uploaded – Word, Excel, etc.. The RESULT is a PDF, but that is just for simplicity sake – most have standardized on PDF as a format that preserves document appearance.
What Karla describes *is* how DocuSign works -> a secure site designed to handle ESIGN transactions, does not require download of software to sign, and each signer can access using just a browser. Clean, easy, done = DocuSign.
There are other options, but none tailored & integrated into Real Estate like DocuSign has been. As for me, I’d really like to know how we can make this better for the Realtor. Listening – let me know what we can do…
-TG
July 12, 2009 — 10:20 pm
Greg Swann says:
TG: After starting this, I’m sorry I haven’t had more time to play along, but I wanted to congratulate you for being such a hard-working dog among the Bloodhounds. You delivered the goods and then stood behind them. Very impressive.
July 13, 2009 — 12:04 am
Cheryl Johnson says:
I watched the initial video and I am intrigued.
Kris, An, others: Which plan are you using? Individual? Small Business? Any add-ons? Advanced?
July 13, 2009 — 6:15 am
Braxton Beyer says:
I think everyone has it covered but you can Docusign pretty much any document. I have been using it for over a year now and could not live without it. It is awesome to be able to get something signed without having to print anything.
July 13, 2009 — 6:50 am
An Bui says:
Cheryl, it really depends on your needs. Advanced is great because then you get more features like automatic expiration reminders for your signers, bulk sending, Outlook integration, etc.
Does anyone have any stories to share about the plan they chose and why?
July 13, 2009 — 7:01 am
Eric Bramlett says:
Tom –
A suggestion, and a question/suggestion:
1) Suggestion: When sending an envelope, use whatever default browser the user has set up. I default to chrome, but it’s opening IE, which is a resource hog. Since I will probably already have chrome open, it would be much faster.
2) Question/Suggestion: Is there a way to make the .pdf’s smaller when you view the completed document? If not, then either allow us to set the resolution/size of the .pdf, or default to a much smaller resolution. They’re a little large right now.
July 14, 2009 — 4:28 pm
TG says:
So on #1 you must be printing into the envelope. I’ll ask the engineering folks how it is bypassing your default browser and starting you in IE. I work in Chrome also, but typically use DS Pro Desktop as my doc prep client because it is so fast.
In a test online – uploading documents into DocuSign, a 50 page PDF was 84K to begin with. The source .docx file is 112k. Once this was processed through DocuSign, signed in multiple locations, and then digitally sealed, the PDF source file was 144K, and the .docx file was 164k. They do grow, but not by too much at that size.
If you start with a poorly formed PDF as we see in many banking and other transactions where the ‘PDF’ is really just a container full of images, you might start with a 6Mb file, and end with a 8Mb file – possibly 10Mb.
I am concerned that proving lots of controls on export might cause confusion or users may create settings that would render the document in such a way as not to match the signed version which could be an issue.
Thanks very much for your questions! Stuff like this is found in the DocuSign Forum where we are trying to gather as much input from users as possible!
-TG
July 14, 2009 — 4:55 pm
Eric Bramlett says:
This is the process where I end up with a big file:
1) I print to docusign from zipformonline.
2) I’m notified the doc is ready and follow the link.
3) I click “view printable document” and save the .pdf
4) I get a 2.09mb file (3 pages,) whereas if I print to pdfcreator, it’s 79kb.
I’m sure I’m not using docusign’s most efficient method of getting a small pdf, but this is the most intuitive way to end up with a pdf of a completed transaction.
July 14, 2009 — 5:09 pm
Susan Pruden says:
Only thing I would add to all this is that we have a form that says all parties to the contract agree to allow or accept digital signatures. And by the way, my clients thinks it’s the coolest thing since sliced bread. No more printing, signing and faxing.
July 15, 2009 — 12:25 am
jay says:
I hired a team member under contract a few months ago and she started with docusign from the beginning. She loves it. I can see how awesome it is, but have been afraid to look into its learning curve as I’m busy and just moved into my first home 🙂
Sold on docusign–is there a trial? Is it month by month?
If Eric says it’s good then it’s good no doubt!
July 22, 2009 — 3:53 am
An Bui, DocuSign Social Media says:
Jay – there is a 30 day trial and you can check it out here: http://docusign.com/real_estate/
July 22, 2009 — 9:02 am
An Bui, DocuSign Social Media says:
Jay – word on the street is that DocuSign is easy to use. We’re also around if you need help – check out http://docusign.com/forums
You can sign up for DocuSign real estate here: http://docusign.com/real_estate/index.php
July 22, 2009 — 9:20 am