What costs $360 a year and puts you in touch with vast hordes of sweet people who cannot do business with you? Starting today, Active Rain will cost $30 a month for new members.
That’s a load of dough. If you want to host your own WordPress.org weblog, a perfectly adequate hosting account at HostGator.com will run you $4.95 a month. Toss in ten bucks a year for the domain and you’re still less than $70 a year. For $7.95 a month, you can host unlimited domains, which puts two domains at $116 a year, three at $126, ten at $196. For $360 a year, you could host 26 unique domains. Or you could get a BloodhoundBlog.net blog for free, aliasing it to your own domain name for free.
The demurrer from ActiveRain will be that they are delivering added value. But most of that added value comes from selling the membership to each other — all with advertising and extra-cost features piled on top.
I met many of the AR folks in Seattle last week. Very nice people, fun and enthusiastic. But if your idea of a productive use of your time is schmoozing with other Realtors, Twitter is (still) free…
Technorati Tags: blogging, real estate, real estate marketing
Doug Quance says:
Although I’m still a member, I pulled my posts long ago.
I knew this day was coming – though I figured that they would charge EVERYONE.
February 16, 2009 — 8:27 am
Tony Arko says:
Wow, I thought it was too expensive when it was free.
February 16, 2009 — 8:30 am
Eric Bramlett says:
It’s not the smartest strategy, IMO. Rather than attempting to charge for something that was previously free, it seems that fees for new “premium services” would be the way to go. Analytics data, streaming listing feeds to aggregator sites, heck even “email blast” services, etc…
February 16, 2009 — 8:35 am
Missy Caulk says:
There is no charge for us that have contributed to the network. (already signed up)
The charge is for new members, and even that is free if you post to members only.
🙂
February 16, 2009 — 8:52 am
Doug Quance says:
After the latest $35MM round of financing for Twitter, one must wonder how they plan to monetize that, as well.
February 16, 2009 — 8:54 am
Colleen Fischesser says:
I too knew this was coming one day and don’t have a problem with it at all. You say “if you think your idea of a productive time is schmoozing other Realtors”…I actually do think this is a valuable use of my time. We network. It works. I actually made this comment in the Seattle unchained event last week when you asked “Who shops for a Realtor?” and I answered that other Realtors do. We can’t sell everywhere and need good agents to refer friends and family. I’ve gotten several referrals from Active Rain. It works.
February 16, 2009 — 9:01 am
Jessica Horton says:
$360.00 really isn’t that bad of a price. I’ve paid more for CE classes and learned way less than I have on Active Rain about certain topics. I picked up a few referrals off of it too when I was actively participating. It has value.
I think you shoot yourself in the foot when you don’t charge everybody, but that’s just me. Regardless, I hope it goes over well.
Mihi ignosce. Cum homine de cane debeo congredi
Err…blog. 😉
February 16, 2009 — 10:50 am
Greg Swann says:
> Mihi ignosce. Cum homine de cane debeo congredi
> Err…blog.
I used to torment my Latin teacher with stuff like that:
Ecce!
Quid dicis?
Quid ludis?
Quis tibi pares
ex dies, in dies?
Infans, infans, infans,
Illa materia mihi dementi facit
Plebicola communicant cum plebeiis
Coitus et violentae classium
Iam noster puerorum captivos adolescent
Totae illarum vitae canto audiens
February 16, 2009 — 11:05 am
Jonathan Washburn says:
Greg,
How have we shot off our right foot, left foot, and left hand?
In the last 30 days we’ve seen over two million unique visitors to the ActiveRain Network with over 80% of those visits being driven by search engines. We’ve done this with less than a 10 person staff and less than 1/10th of the VC raised by our competitors.
We serve over 130,000 members and represent one of the most loved brands in the real estate industry. We are loyal to our members first and in return they are loyal to us. It is in our member’s interest to ensure that ActiveRain is a viable and profitable business. I am very passionate about making ActiveRain be the best service possible for real estate professionals and in order to achieve that goal we must have revenue to invest back into our business.
We still offer a free membership option for new members to our community, however if those new members want to tap into our HUGE consumer reach then they will have to pay what is essentially a marketing fee.
Jessica, Thank you for your feedback. We’ve made a commitment to our members in the past that we would not charge them for services that they were already using for free. So to keep that promise we chose to only charge new members.
Colleen, You’re right, networking with other professionals in the real estate industry has always been a productive use of time for successful real estate agents.
February 16, 2009 — 11:12 am
Bob says:
I thought this was a joke.
Even funnier now that it isnt.
February 16, 2009 — 11:41 am
Todd Covington says:
The story line seems to almost be comical. And it happens every time. Company has a great idea, company dose a fantastic job implementing their idea, idea is a smashing success, company grows exponentially, company is on top of the world and operation in perfect order, busybody company executives want more, executives come up with crappy ideas that are in no way in line with what made the company successful in the first place, company implements busybody executive’s plan, company takes a big hit, smaller company finds an opening, big company now has a fight on it’s hands by giving the small guy an opening. Why is this formula of sheer stupidity and greed never avoided. The big executives must know something I don’t. With real estate being the most competitive business on the internet it sure seems like Activerain would be much much smarter than this.
February 16, 2009 — 12:45 pm
Thesa Chambers says:
Many of us have seen this day coming and knew it was like the old saying “if it is too good to be true – it probably is.” ActiveRain has served me well and I appreciate the opportunity I have had and still have, but you are right – sometimes it is better to move on to what take care of yourself.
I found that ActiveRain brought me to people like you… and I have learned a lot – and have finally started using what I had right in front of me… my own blog on my website.
I had wanted to attend the Unchained and REBAR this week in Seattle – however I had too many buyers in town from my own blog.
February 16, 2009 — 1:32 pm
Broker Bryant says:
I will make well over 50k in 2009 just from my blogging and participation on AR. How do I know that? Because I have made that minimum every year thus far. In fact my goal is to make over 100k JUST from AR for 2009. Anyone that thinks AR is just RE Pros talking amongst themsleves has not utilized the paltform to it’s full potential. But it’s certainly not for everyone. We all to have find our own little niches.
February 16, 2009 — 4:27 pm
JeffX says:
Vos vestros servate, meos mihi linquite mores…
February 16, 2009 — 5:16 pm
Greg Swann says:
> Vos vestros servate, meos mihi linquite mores…
From the Pink Floyd, I always thought this should be on the crest of every software company: Debemus insanos in semita custodire.
February 16, 2009 — 5:47 pm
Fred says:
Still not sure why so many people assume that everything must be free online. Successful businesses not only are entitled to make money, they must make money or they will go OUT of business.
If you don’t like Active Rain, don’t use it! If you find it is of value (I definitely feel that it is), then it’s time to pay up! I see nothing wrong with charging a fair price for your services. And… like everything… if you don’t think it’s fair, nobody is twisting your arm!
February 16, 2009 — 5:17 pm
teresa boardman says:
Love your post title, still smiling.
February 16, 2009 — 5:40 pm
Bob says:
I find it interesting that people in a biz where they tell others about the value of building equity in their own property dont follow their own advice.
I have no doubt that people have made money from AR, but I also have no doubt that the same money could have been made with the same effort if they had invested in their own site, not someone else’s.
I see AR as the Madoff Hedge Fund of real estate, where your assets built someone else’s empire.
February 16, 2009 — 10:31 pm
JeffX says:
@bob ‘where your assets built someone elses empire’…and what is the fundamental difference between the authors who choose to contribute their assets to build this fine (or other collaborative) venue vs those who choose to contribute to AR?
Madoff was a scam artist who stole peoples value for nothing in return. Poor analogy.
February 16, 2009 — 11:01 pm
Thomas Johnson says:
The part I love is they give you a badge if you pay them money!
They have to salvage HouseValues somehow. In our area, I have not seen a
HouseValues/Just Listed TV ad in ages. I wonder if they just send out recycled leads
from 2006 for $50 a pop.
February 17, 2009 — 12:57 am
Teri Lussier says:
Jonathon-
From my inbox, regarding the changes, a “founding” AR member said:
>it kind of hurts my soul.
The things people don’t tell us are often the things we need to pay attention to.
February 17, 2009 — 4:40 am
Bob says:
@Jeff,
The authors here are mere contributors, with only a few posting even weekly. While they add value, this has never been their primary venue. They have put the bulk of their effort into their own works.
I stand by my analogy. Madoff returned 10% like clockwork for years. People were happy because they did make money. AR has been playing with things for a while now and the SEO value proposition isn’t what it used to be, and there is no guarantee it will be there for the individual in the future.
Does anyone believes that AR is going to survive with a monetization plan of ads and selling the right to blog on their platform? As the monetization strategy changes, so will the SEO. It already has. At the end of the day, AR will be a different animal, built with the sweat equity of others. Many will have poured thousands of hours into something that gave them great returns for awhile, but would have yielded far more on their own online properties.
The big difference is that you can withdraw your content equity.
February 17, 2009 — 9:25 am
Greg Swann says:
> How have we shot off our right foot, left foot, and left hand?
Hide and watch. Allowing for black swans, no one is going to pay you $30 a month. Ask the folks over at Jott.com how things are working out for them at $3.95 a month.
> we must have revenue to invest back into our business.
Your marginal incremental cost per user is certainly less than $5 a month, probably less than $1 a month. Why do we offer free weblogs, including free Scenius scene weblogs? Because the added strain on our server is next to nothing. It’s plausible that we could add enough blogs that we would have to split the free blogs onto a second file server, in which case the actual added expense per weblog would be less than half-a-cent a month. And we pay retail for our server. With big needs, we would pay a lot less per webserver.
As is discussed in my post, I think AR users could do a lot better for themselves by flying their own flags. They could and should make a lot more money by marketing real estate directly to their target markets, and they can do a whole lot more with $360 a year than they will get from ActiveRain. Each man to his own saints, but AR is and always has been the kiddie-pool built safely apart from the oceans of information.
How’d the lawsuit turn out? Since you were completely in the wrong as regards written contracts, my guess is the settlement involved your not having to pay Move’s legal fees. Is that about right?
I wish you luck in this new effort to monetize AR, in any case.
February 17, 2009 — 9:41 am
JeffX says:
@Bob-
“The authors here are mere contributors…”
-While BHB is ostensibly ‘Greg Swann’, the authors here are not ‘mere contributors’…they are part of a hand picked Tribe that makes BHB what it is.
“They have put the bulk of their effort into their own works.”
-100% of ones efforts are ones own works..?
People publish in part or in whole here for the exposure, edification and experience…same dynamic on AR.
Where your analogy falls ignorantly short is that Madoff ran an fraudulent Ponzi scheme unbeknown to his investors. Please point out where AR is running a fraudulent scheme? This is a defamatory reach at sensationalism…a shallow play to the crowd.
“AR has been playing with things for a while now and the SEO value proposition isn’t what it used to be…Does anyone believes that AR is going to survive with a monetization plan of ads and selling the right to blog on their platform? As the monetization strategy changes, so will the SEO. It already has.”
-Are you an SEO pundit? How will/has the SEO ‘changed’.?…and AR has multiple revenue streams, which seems to be the bone of contention here.
It is completely within AR’s right to monetize their site. Will everyone agree with the strategies? Of course not.
Why is it more admirable nowadays to raise $100M based on superfluous value rather than charge $10 (or whatever) based on tangible value?
Would I today, personally pay $29 to have a public facing blog on AR, with my relative acumen level? No, for the same reasons I wouldn’t pay $199 or $29 to attend BHBU.
Would I consider it if I was just starting out in Social Media? Probably.
‘there is no guarantee it will be there for the individual in the future.’
There are no guarantees in life Bob, period. If we all moved with such risk adverse tendencies, we’d still be rubbing two sticks together to make fire.
“The big difference is that you can withdraw your content equity.”
-Last I checked, anyone who has contributed a word of content to AR can withdraw it anytime they wish.
AR isn’t for everyone, but it is for many. Professionals will come and go…much like the revolving membership on the sidebar of this site.
February 17, 2009 — 1:27 pm
Scott Nelson says:
http://medfordhouseblog.blogspot.com/2009/02/bloodhoundblogcom-de-commodotize-your.html – following BHB advise I’m posting my narrative on my blog.
My blog on Active Rain regarding their new policy:
http://activerain.com/blogsview/937133/Active-Rain-Charging-Now
I’m not knocking AR (well maybe a little), but in my opinion I think I’m better off putting my efforts into my own website, blog, etc. than building a competitor’s site with uncertain Terms of Service that are subject to change without my imput.
I wonder how many AR users would have voted to enact the new charges (fees) if given the option. Getting in on the ground floor does have it’s advantages, but perhaps it’s also short sighted in who we may end up alienating (new agents/brokers/partners) that are put off by the new Terms of Service
February 17, 2009 — 1:50 pm
Bob says:
Jeff, I never used the word “fraudulent”, nor did I make any such characterization. I said that what you have is one entity using others’ assets to build their empire, and there is no guarantee as to how that content can be used in the future, or if it will even exist. Terms of service change, as may the controlling entities. No one knows how this ends up and no one knows that they’ll have absolute control of their content from one day to the next. I know I didn’t, as one day it magically disappeared.
I’m not questioning anyone’s integrity. However, we all know that business decisions frequently trump previously stated good intentions.
“Are you an SEO pundit?”
Yes.
February 17, 2009 — 3:46 pm
JeffX says:
Hey Bob-
If I compared your company to a Bernie Madoff enterprise, how would you take it?
When you choose to contribute to a website like AR, FaceBook, BHB, you are fundamentally contributing your assets to ‘build their empire’…but their must be some reciprocal value otherwise people wouldn’t continue to participate.
My advice to anyone who wants to listen is to maintain a presence on AR (or other well trafficked 3rd party domain) as well as keeping their content on an autonomously controlled (or as close to that as possible) domain…as an overall content syndication strategy.
AR is very cognizant that a members content is theirs and are in the process of making it ‘one click’ easy to zip up and export personal content appropriately.
Since you are an SEO Pundit, what do you think of the SE’s support of canonical url tags?
February 17, 2009 — 4:23 pm
Bob says:
Jeff – Clearly I hit a nerve. Do you have a stake in AR, or did you lose money with Madoff?
“what do you think of the SE’s support of canonical url tags?”
If I operated a site where I had multiple versions of the same page (created by session id’s, multiple product categories, etc.), I would be thrilled. For what we do, there have been easy ways to handle dupe content on the same sites.
With blogs, the issue usually arises with tagging, archives and categories. Joost De Valk has a canonical url links plugin you may want to check out.
This won’t have anything to do with syndicated content on another domain though – like if you were to publish the same content on AR and your own site. Your best bet in that case is to not publish the full content on AR. Do a lead in or synopsis on AR and publish the full article on your own site. You will get the AR link to an internal page on your own site, and if the article has value that compels others to link to it, they’ll likely link to the full article and not the AR page.
Suffice it to say, AR has sculpted PR to the detriment of their content providers in order to funnel more towards their investor’s product. That would be fine, except that part of the sales pitch on AR for paying to play was the SEO value. If you are a newbie, you will get very little, and all but a few of the old timers will find theirs diminishing.
February 17, 2009 — 6:39 pm
JeffX says:
Bob-
Stake in AR, I think that’s obvious. No losses via Madoff.
“AR has sculpted PR to the detriment of their content providers in order to funnel more towards their investor’s product”
-Care to expound a bit further? I ask with genuine curiosity…Its not making sense to me…
February 17, 2009 — 6:54 pm
Bob says:
I didn’t know about your involvement with AR.
FWIW, I always take your stance as genuine. Gotta run, but will expound when i get back.
February 17, 2009 — 7:46 pm
Tim O'Keefe says:
You have no where to go when you start at 0.
February 18, 2009 — 12:53 am
Greg Tracy says:
Anytime you take investment capitol there will be pressure to make a return and usually that pressure is to charge more than you should as to make a quicker ROI.
Active Rain, with or without HV’s investment, should benefit from their platform and I think it’s only good business to monetize their services.
That’s capitalism and it’s a good thing.
I think they could have found better ways to monetize it (for instance- they have a great resource of industry people on their system so their ad platform could be a huge revenue generator if they improved it), but no matter what they do to make money, some people will disagree with it.
This feels like a fee drummed up by HV, not by the guys at AR, but that’s just my sense of it.
Greg- whether or not people agree with the content of your message, the title of your post is freaking hilarious!
February 18, 2009 — 11:14 am
Houston says:
I wonder if a single person has agreed to start paying 30 bucks a month. Agents are cutting back.. even leaving the business. No one wants to be the only guy paying! I bet this doesn’t last three months before they start hitting up the existing members.
February 18, 2009 — 7:35 pm
Jessica Horton says:
Jon,
My comment about A|R was objective – I have gotten more value from some of the members than I have in some CE classes, but it was NOT an invitation for you to speak directly to me. Just because I said something nice doesn’t mean that we kissed and made up. Hardly.
You can save your words for others because I don’t have any use for you or anything that you have to say – even if you’re only “brainstorming”. I’ve told you before and I will tell you again: Do not speak to me.
I’m only back at A|R because this agent in my small town little market advertises that he/she is Mr(s). Web 2.0 and does blogging on all his listings on A | R. Funny, that he/she has only written one darn post and it has nothing to do with blogging a listing. But, sellers are now asking me about it and I can tell them that I’m on there too. But, that’s as far as I’m willing to pay the monkey see, monkey do game.
February 19, 2009 — 6:34 am
Melina Tomson says:
Okay I’ll weigh in since I have been a member of AR since August 2007…
I think AR is a great training ground. I personally don’t spend a lot of time there schmoozing other agents because I have other things to do with my time, BUT I do think it has value.
I think the challenge with AR, as with an blog site, is finding agents you respect and that you can learn and grow from. I think AR is great for people just starting out who are clueless about blogging, such as myself back in 2007.
I have my own outside WP blog integrated with my website that I had designed by Dakno, which I found on AR. Many agents talked about the value of non-AR blogs on AR, so I started one fairly soon thereafter.
My non-AR blog easily trumps AR on SEO, BUT I don’t think it is appropriate to trash AR when they do offer a lot to those agents that choose to take advantage of it. I think all businesses have to monetize. FB, MySpace, Twitter, etc are going to have to figure out at some point how to generate revenue. Ad money will only get you so far.
Do I think it would have been better to charge all members $9.95 a month rather than charge newbies $30 a month…probably. I’d pay $10 a month because there is some really good information on there minus the pantyhose polls and discussions about dryer vents…BUT AR is not like BHB where you hand pick bloggers. It’s a place for everyone to try something new and “work out the kinks” in their blogging voice.
I think that aspect has value.
February 19, 2009 — 12:20 pm
Bob says:
Maybe when it was free, but not at $30 a month.
February 20, 2009 — 12:58 pm