I doubt that even Jeff realizes this, but I am the provocateur of the Titans’ duel over the pros and cons of dual agency. It started when Greg and I met Russell Shaw. The man is a font of knowledge, and he’s very very generous with sharing the “secrets” to his success. Already we have been enriched by his friendship. As we discussed the different aspects of our industry last Tuesday night, conversation led to our stand on dual agency, which I am largely responsible for.
Dual agency has not even been an opportunity for me yet… so far I haven’t had a buying client who would have been interested in any of my listings. But I’ve seen Greg serve as a disclosed dual agent, and as promised by Russell and Jeff the successfully closed transactions were probably more successful for his clients because Greg handled both sides. In all but one of the cases I can think of, the buyers and sellers were investors. The exception was with an extreme pet lover who needed an agent to find her a buyer without using the MLS (someday Greg will have to write this Realty Reality story). But then we had the dear friend failure and when we evaluated the philosophy of dual agency, we established our No Dual Agency policy.
This policy has not been easy on us. It certainly hasn’t given us a market advantage, because the typical home buyer or seller doesn’t pay that much attention to the philosophy of our industry. In fact, we end up shedding prospects who come to us through avenues that other brokerages use to drum up new clients. When I hold open houses in areas where open houses actually bring in potential buyers, I always try to find an agent from a different brokerage to sit the open house with me, so that agent can try to turn visitors into clients. When we get sign calls, we’ll show the house, but when the prospect starts making buying signs, we’ll suggest that they get an agent to represent them or offer to refer them (and we won’t take a referral fee on the transaction). Then there was the time when a client hired us to market his house, then after a couple of weeks and our typical traffic of more than a hundred visitors, he took advantage of our firing clause and hired a limited service lister to glean the prospects from visitors who we had introduced to the house. At first we thought this was a real boon for us, because we could circle back to try to pick up the buying side, which was getting a bigger piece of the commission pie than the listing side. But then we realized that it would be nearly impossible for us to represent the buyer as completely as we wanted without betraying the confidential knowledge that we had regarding the seller’s motivation and the appraised value of the house.
Plus, our policy forces us to stay small. We can’t expect to bring more agents into our brokerage, which would multiply the potential for dual agency, and ask the agents to walk away from prospective business, when that business would put the brokerage into a dual agency position.
So I have actually been hoping to be convinced through reason that dual agency has a place in our business. I agree with our worthy opponents that legislation prohibiting wrong acts in order to stop people from doing the wrong acts that they already are supposed to not be doing is a farce. It’s not the gun that kills, it’s the murderer; and making guns illegal will only mean that people who care about the law won’t have guns, but the murderer still will. Back to dual agency… unfortunately, this means that good people will be hurt by unscrupulous agents who practice dual agency wrongly, then those good people will blame our industry in general. And maybe they should…
But I am looking at this issue more narrowly… what’s the right thing for BloodhoundRealty.com to do? When I’m representing a seller, I want to use every weapon in our arsenal to get that house sold for as high a price possible in the client’s timeframe. And if refusing to practice dual agency limits market exposure in any way, am I doing right by my seller-client? I believe that our system of referring prospective buyers to buyers’ brokers usually lets me answer “yes” to that question, because the market is no longer narrowed; though as I’ve already noted, it doesn’t help our business. But I recently had a potential for a disclosed dual agency that would have been impossible for me to avoid. I listed a property that I thought would be ideal for my brother-in-law as an investment. Fortunately, the property sold before my brother-in-law ever pursued the opportunity. But if he ever wants to buy a property I have listed, what is my recourse? It would be wrong for me to interrupt a chain of events that might result in my seller-client’s property being sold if the buyer-client is a relative of mine (who by nature of our familial relationship is my de facto client), just because my brokerage’s policy forbids dual agency. Now that’s between a rock and a hard place!
I hope you understand that I truly want to be convinced that because it’s legal in Arizona, dual agency has its place in BloodhoundRealty.com. In fact, the other evening I was about to give in. If this is legal, and it’s the way everyone works, and most clients don’t even care, why shouldn’t we permit dual agency? Perhaps we should just explain the pros and cons of dual agency, and then let the client decide whether to allow/ask us to enter it if we have a prospective match for them. I was about to give in. But then serendipity stepped in. When we finished work one evening this weekend, we sat down to watch our new DVD of The Fountainhead.
Though I don’t remember the quote, I’m sure Jeff is correct, when he attributes to Ayn Rand,
If the results you wish continually fail to materialize – check your premises.
But I think the Objectivism philosophy more germane to this debate is addressed in The Fountainhead. That is, collective “wisdom” is no substitute for the fully awakened, reasoning, rational mind of the individual. Then when I saw Russell credit Peter Keating, of all people, with having thrice solidly articulate a defense of dual agency, when all I saw were Keating’s loquacious defenses, I was stopped cold. I do want Jeff and Russell and others of similar thoughtfulness to be correct, because that would be easy. But what I want — and the way the mob runs — doesn’t answer the paradox Greg pointed out today.
I might wish that we had some of the advantages that are apparently enjoyed by agents in Georgia, Florida and Washington. But we don’t. And the way I understand it, agents in those states are able to practice dual agency more easily than agents in Arizona and California, because the former states don’t assign fiduciary duties to their agents. I’m not sure that’s much of an improvement, but it sure seems more straight forward to me… easier.
And I might wish that one of the powerhouse agents in dual-agency states could make the argument that I haven’t yet seen… I concede that dual-agency is better for a brokerage’s business. And I concede that this is the way most other agents, both ones with integrity and those without, work. But I still don’t understand how agency which includes the duty of fiduciary can be served in a dual agency situation, without taking away some of the zealous representation a client should have right to expect. But I realize this is my problem, not yours. So I thank you, Russell and Jeff, for taking the time to try to help.
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Reuben Moore says:
Cathleen – I am very much in your boat – We have a small firm, and as we grow, I would very much like to have the option of using dual agency. So, I see both sides of the debate.
Seems we have us a contradiction….
Now either Jeff’s quote was a little off or it is one I just do not know. The Rand quote I do remember is this:
“There is no such thing as a contradiction. When you find one, check your premises. You will find that one of them is incorrect.”
As for Peter Keating….Well, that’s harsh – but I am sure Peter Keating does not know “Peter Keating.”
November 20, 2006 — 4:58 pm
Jeff Brown says:
>And I might wish that one of the powerhouse agents in dual-agency states could make the argument that I haven’t yet seen… I concede that dual-agency is better for a brokerage’s business. And I concede that this is the way most other agents, both ones with integrity and those without, work. But I still don’t understand how agency which includes the duty of fiduciary can be served in a dual agency situation, without taking away some of the zealous representation a client should have right to expect. But I realize this is my problem, not yours. So I thank you, Russell and Jeff, for taking the time to try to help.
I’d love to have a phone conversation with, as I think it’s possible you could discover a way to make use of dual agency without frying forever. π
BTW, as I view your picture it’s obvious there’s another thing Greg and I have in common. Blind luck.
November 20, 2006 — 5:02 pm
ardell dellaloggia says:
Cathleen,
How many Dual Agency transactions have you and Greg done that worked out badly? I have none. I have more that worked out badly when another agent did something screwy.
Is it the “idea” that it could be bad? Hell, they all can be bad sometimes.
I love my Dual Agency deals…they truly have been my very best ones. Everyone happy. No other agent in the middle mis-communicating the facts at hand. A true meeting of the minds between all parties.
I say do it until your personal experience, and not just one bad one out of 50 sales, says otherwise.
Sellers DO NOT hire you to turn buyers away…remember that! If a buyer wants to buy your seller’s house, try telling the seller, “Oh by the way, the Jones’ wanted to by your house, but I sent them away. See how that one goes over when the new agent sells them a different house π
And buyers like to talk with someone who knows the house best…the listing agent. And the extra dollars in the middle help fix everything before closing…lots of advantages.
November 20, 2006 — 6:09 pm
Nathan Hughes says:
Maybe I’m missing something, or maybe the rules are different here in Virginia. Why can’t you just disclose to the buyer that you represent the seller and just let the buyer be unrepresented.
Even if I have a good friend that is looking at a listing that I have, I tell them upfront that I am obligated to certain disclosures to the seller. That works even if I am bringing a buyer to the table on a listing that I don’t represent individually, because I may have inside knowledge by virtue of being in a small office.
If I disclose my client relationship, then there shouldn’t be a dilemma.
November 20, 2006 — 6:19 pm
ok says:
Whenever I hear an agent say that they’re dual agency deals have worked out well I can’t help but think they are looking through money colored glasses. I do not think that Ardell told the buyer all that she could not do for them because of dual agency. Had she they may have gone with an agent who would and could represent them fully. Shame on you if you did a Dual agency deal. Even if the NAR or the local real estate chapter lets you do it Dual Agency is ethically wrong.
November 20, 2006 — 7:18 pm
Greg Swann says:
> BTW, as I view your picture it’s obvious there’s another thing Greg and I have in common. Blind luck.
The poet always gets the girl. That’s a law of nature…
November 20, 2006 — 7:50 pm
Greg Swann says:
> Why can’t you just disclose to the buyer that you represent the seller and just let the buyer be unrepresented.
Are you filling out the contract, or are they doing it on their own or with an attorney? If I were filling out the contract and I gave a meaningful answer to any question arising from the contract, I would probably be an Undisclosed Dual Agent in Arizona — deep shit. It’s possible to argue that the buyer is unrepresented, but the listing agent had better wear a bio-hazard suit. Agency is contagious and irrevocable here.
November 20, 2006 — 7:54 pm
Jeff Brown says:
Reuben – You’re correct about the Rand quote. It doesn’t change the meaning I intended to convey though.
I sure wish she’d written a lot more, don’t you?
Thanks for the help.
November 20, 2006 — 8:45 pm
Jeff Brown says:
OK – I have an idea. If you’re going to impune the integrity of someone, why don’t you grow a pair, and identify yourself. You’ll gain some respect, and maybe a little credibility too.
November 20, 2006 — 8:57 pm
Ardell says:
OK,
Just because it is “Dual Agency” doesn’t mean there is “double money”. Could simply be a FSBO seller with NO money for seller representation, where the buyer and seller asked me to do both sides for less than the price of one. Your “submitting facts not in evidence” LOL, is skewing your comment.
In fact the last one I did was a total of 2% to do both sides…so NOPE! You are incorrect. Not my “money colored glasses” at all. Agency and money are two completely different topics, and when I have done “Dual Agency” it was because neither party would allow me to do it any other way.
November 22, 2006 — 3:15 pm