I’ve written about this before. This is an issue that just isn’t going to go away. Like most oppressive rules and laws this bad rule (at least as it is currently interpreted and practiced) was a sincere attempt to solve a problem. Unfortunately, the current rule creates a whole new type of problem. The solution is the new problem.
Should any misleading or deceitful statement statement be permitted on a website? No and the NAR Code of Ethics already covered that. But this issue – at least as it now stands – is a good example of “an innocent dolphin caught in a tuna net”. The very idea that an NAR committee came up with a restriction for Realtors that our competitors – who are trying to put us out of business – don’t have to follow is just absurd.
NAR will have no ability whatsoever to stop, inhibit, or prevent anyone BUT Realtors from using the term “MLS” in their URL. So why would it be alright to inhibit a Realtor while other companies are using the term and will continue to use the term (both as a meta tag and as part of the URL)?
__
Here is another letter Steve Westmark passed along to me.
From: Jim Lee
To: gary@garyashton.com ; steve@stevewestmark.com
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2008 10:35 AM
Subject: Fwd: Letter to NAR VP Cliff Niersbach
Gentlemen, Another Realtor friend of mine, Bill Holt who is in the Outer Banks area of North Carolina, has a URL with those troublesome magic letters “MLS” (www.obxMLS.com) and is having the same issues we are.Fortunately Bill has a member of his board who is on the NAR Professional Standards subcommittee, Policy and Interpretation, or some such name. He has talked with her and another long time member of that subcommittee named Ted Kelly. They both seem to feel that to be in violation of the new COE’s Article 12 that a member’s intent would be very important, i.e. are you trying to pass yourself off as ‘THE’ MLS. Mr. Kelly gave Bill Cliff Niersbach’s name who is some sort of NAR VP to talk with. Bill is sending him the letter below.I just wanted to keep you both in the loop since we’re all dealing with this issue right now.Any advice and suggestions appreciated at any time.
Best regards,
Jim
Cliff,
I received your name and contact information from Ted Kelly after a lengthy discussion with Ted on Wednesday evening regarding the recently published Standard of Practice (12-10) regarding ‘prohibition on use of deceptive meta tags, key words, and other devices intended to direct/drive Internet traffic to REALTORS’ websites’. I have prepared some information in hopes you will review it and lend me guidance on the issue as it relates to my specific circumstances. I have been on the MLS Committee for 5+ years and presently sit as Chair of that Committee which also carries with it a seat on the Association of REALTORS BOD. Based on how the President reads the Code Interpretation, she has called and asked me to take down my web domain stating to me it is in violation. (www.obxmls.com). As a 31 year member of the National Association of REALTORS, I have held myself to the high standards I swore to follow each time I took the oath (3 separate Associations in 2 states and several times as a Line officer once as President).In 2000, when I began my relocation to North Carolina, I registered several domains to use in marketing my Real Estate business. I studied and learned about the web for many years under folks like Saul Klein, John Reilly, Jack Harper & Mike Barnett through their creation and energies put forward in many mediums including seed development of Realtor.com and Real Town – Internet Crusade. Jack Harper was the first web designer I used in 1995/6. I have always followed the rules and have always directed those I use in web design and positioning to stay clear of many things ‘we’, as REALTORS, are unable to do as we follow the Code of Ethics we work under.I purchased the above referenced domain on May 15, 2000. I had purchased www.outerbanksmls.com on April 4, 2000 and www.homesinouterbanks.com on March 15, 2000. I have numerous other domains in ownership; all except www.obxmls.com are not being used at this time. Through my education from those mentioned above, I purchased the one I presently use as it is short and easy to remember and memorable for my customers and clients. I have never marketed myself as the MLS. I use obxmls.com as an unregistered (at this time) business service mark beginning with a lease on a Xerox Printer I leased back in 2000 when I first began my business on the Outer Banks in NC. I do not use outerbanksmls.com as it could easily be confused as being associated with the local MLS. I do retain rights to it so no one else will use it. After relocating here I purchased a custom license plate for my vehicle with the same letters ‘OBXMLS’ and to this day, I use it on my truck. Within the laws of NC, I universally use the term as a business trade name/service mark.As I stay current on trends and issues in RE, I have followed with keen interest, the issues relative to use of the term ‘REALTOR’ and it prohibition of use in domain keyword/meta tag marketing. Upon becoming aware of the NAR’s energies to prohibit the use of Meta tags, keywords and other devices back in 2006 or 2007, I carefully reviewed my web site to make sure I was in compliance with the spirit and intent of NAR anticipated position. Having found no potential issue with my Meta Tags or Keywords and assuring myself I was not doing anything that would mistakenly allow my site to be perceived as the site of the local MLS, I added a notice on the front page (above any visual line of any size or resolution monitor) of my site stating I was not the official site of the MLS or Association. Disclosure, Disclosure! [ NOTICE: WWW.OBXMLS.COM is NOT the official website of the Outer Banks Association of Realtors Multiple Listing Service. WWW.OBXMLS.COM & its contents are the copyrighted property of Bill Holt, a NC Licensed Real Estate Broker & Member of the Outer Banks Association of Realtors. ]As evidenced in the documents attached, any search done by a member of the public, or a REALTOR, will not bring up my site for many pages deep into a search on Google. If you do a search on Google for ‘Outer Banks MLS’ my site does not come up until page 15. That is nearly 148 sites deep, hardly a threat to anyone. The only reasons I can find within my site for it showing up at all, is the above notice on page one, which I am using as a disclosure/disclaimer. There are however, many pages of apparent violations of Standards of Practice 12-10 in the search results. Many of my competitors apparently are using Meta Tags, Keywords or other devices intended to direct and drive traffic to their sites.
One of the early internet friends I made back in 1995, Jim Lee of Knoxville, TN, has a similar site that is used by Internet Crusade in their presentation and training within the ePRO™ certification course offered as a designation within the family of designation at NAR. He was instrumental in my selection of the domain I am presently using. We, together with many others around the country, are staying current and are following all cases on this issue as they are important to our livelihood and ongoing business marketing and success. After many years of marketing a web site to our client/consumer base, a changed forced upon us, by an organization with apparently no legal registration or copyright on the term ‘MLS’, could be considered a ‘restraint of trade’.
I received a call from our Association President Wednesday afternoon. She asked me directly ‘In light of the recent Standard of Practice being published are you planning on taking your domain name down’? To avoid controversy, I simply stated I was well aware of the SOP and that I was incompliance with the intent of the SOP. I informed her I would not be taking the site down. She indicated she felt that as a member of the BOD and Chair of the MLS Committee, that the SOP clearly stated the use of MLS in a domain, was a violation and she would have to bring the issue to the BOD. Our meeting is Tuesday morning at 9:00 AM where I anticipate she will carry her conversation on with the BOD in an effort to force me to take it down. Obviously, regardless of my positions within the Association, I am entitled to due process afforded me through the Grievance and Professional Standards processes.
I carefully informed her that she needed to do her research and consider the intent and actual wording in the SOP prior to presenting her position to the BOD. Unfortunately, I am not perceived to be in her favor as I was a challenger for the seat on the BOD as well as other reasons leading to the belief that this is more personal, not factual. To that end, I choose my normal course and rise above personal issues and act as the Professional I have always been. I then contacted Ted Kelly as he was the Professional Standards Trainer who directed our training in 2007, which I did attend even though I was not a member of that Committee at the time.
Our Code of Ethics is a living Code and is adjusted accordingly as business needs and practices warrant. I have always followed it to the Letter and feel I have done everything possible to represent myself professionally and live by the Code I swore to uphold. Could you please take the time to review the circumstances presented here, along with the documents I have provided in PDF format for your review, and send me a recommendation on how NAR would truly look at the issue relative to my circumstance. The intent of the SOP applicable here is the key. I believe I have complied with the intent of the SOP in full.
Thank you for taking the time to look and review. I look forward to hearing from you after reviewing the issue. I can be reached via cell – 252.619.7010 or Toll Free 866.629.6571 (866.OBXMLS1); or by email – Bill@obxmls.com .
Respectfully presented,
Bill Holt
RE/MAX Ocean Realty
www.obxmls.com__
Me? I’m thinking of adding this to all of my sites.
Missy Caulk says:
Russell, keep harping as the subject will not go away, Look what comes up for http://AnnArborMLS.com A third party vendor.
Ridiculous… wonder if they pay NAR dues? nope.
March 11, 2008 — 4:25 am
Thomas Johnson says:
http://www.ERAHouston.com is a huge Houston Dynamo fan.
Back to back MLS Champions!
http://web.mlsnet.com/t200/
Orange Forever!
March 11, 2008 — 6:50 am
Doug Quance says:
>Missy: That’s no vendor. That’s a splog.
March 11, 2008 — 8:01 am
Missy Caulk says:
Thanks Doug ! Ok then splogs are also using mls. LOL
March 11, 2008 — 8:44 am
Sean Purcell says:
Russell,
Thought provoking post. As my previous comments would attest, I am no fan of NAR. But I find myself leaning toward their side of the fence on this one.
I understand how difficult it will be for Mr. Holt to change a name he has branded, but what was his intent when he bought and decided to use a URL with MLS in it? The fact that someone has put a lot of time and money into a marketing ploy does not mitigate the impropriety of that ploy. What other expectation did he have when he began using MLS in his URL (and license plate and business card and where ever else he has it) but to imply that he, at the very least, has some type of special access to the MLS? Isn’t this the very essence of why NAR prohibits it? Wouldn’t that be the “spirit of the law”?
As often as I carp on the MLS and their continued contortions to keep listing info proprietary while the walls come down around them, the bottom line is that MLS is proprietary. A lot of time and money went into creating it. While I look forward to the day that there is no need for it whatsoever, we are not there yet. If one is going to use the MLS, then one should play by the MLS rules… even while trying to eliminate the need for it.
Mr. Holt claims he is acting within “the spirit” of the law which, by its very statement, implies his awareness that he may not be in compliance with the letter of the law (or, as Greg Swann might say: res ipse loquitur). IMHO, he is acting within the spirit of his interpretation of the law… for his own benefit.
March 11, 2008 — 8:57 am
Jay says:
Give me a break, Sean!
You stated:
“What other expectation did he have when he began using MLS in his URL (and license plate and business card and where ever else he has it) but to imply that he, at the very least, has some type of special access to the MLS?”
he is not implying he has some type of special access to the mls. He is letting the public know they can search the mls listings there. And if you check a large portion of agent sites have “mls” in their URL’s somewhere in their websites. Are those URLs also supposed to refrain from “mls”? Who cares and why should pahying members to NAR, etc. be persecuted for procuring buyers to buy the data entry agents (listing agents) houses? Isn’t that what NAR would like? This issue is so assinine.
If a real estate policy is behind the times, I have no problem with anybody operating in today’s reality versus observing the policy to better serve the public. All the pressure should be on NAR to get a clue about how much respect/credibility they are losing with their nonsense.
I was at a lunch yesterday with an association CEO and the question came up how many of us (about 7 at the lunch) use the word “realtor” in our marketing and websites, etc. Almost nobody did. Why? Because it’s a negative word now due to the antics/bullcrap of the NAR the past 2 years. This is another example why I hide “realtor” now from what I do.
Reconsider, Sean.
j
March 11, 2008 — 10:25 am
Lane Bailey says:
It is a stupid rule. No matter what the intent… as long and Russell doesn’t have his sign on there… the simple fact is that the rules ONLY apply to members of the NAR. So, here in Atlanta, where I don’t have to be a member of the NAR to access the MLS, I could discontinue my membership and then start up a site with MLS in the title and there is nothing the NAR could do about it. And it would put me at an immediate advantage over NAR members…
Dumb move on the part of NAR “leadership”. Not only is the cat out of the bag, but the bag is gone. So is the cat.
March 11, 2008 — 10:25 am
Sevierville Real Estate says:
I am still confused at the fact that NAR is able to dictate where we can use the term MLS. I may be mistaken but does NAR own the term MLS? Do they have the rights to it?! I have always been under the impression that “MLS” was owned by Major League Soccer. I need some clarity on how they are able to do what they are doing.
March 11, 2008 — 10:32 am
David Phillips says:
I was on the NAR MLS Committee when this policy was formulated. Several of us voted against it and argued many of the same points that have been argued here. In the end, we lost on a split vote (at least I was not alone).
There is hope. A few of us argued for NAR to come up with a new name for MLS and trademark it. If you read Stefan Swanepoel’s 2008 Trends Report (summarized on CAARBlog.com), you will see he raises the question of NAR losing control of the term MLS. NAR has used MLS – Multiple Listing Service – for years, but the trademark has already been taken by Major League Soccer. Recently, NAR and many local associations have tried to pass rules limiting the use of the term, but at least one lawsuit has already been filed by members (Wisconsin I think). Since NAR does not have the trademark, it is going to be impossible for them to stop the rampant use of the term MLS (i.e., “search the MLS”). Non-members, including newspapers and websites, can freely use the term and there is nothing NAR can do to stop it. Many question why NAR does not just create a new term, trademark it, and move on. That’s exactly what REALTORS® in Indianapolis did when they came up with Broker Listing Cooperative (BLC).
March 11, 2008 — 2:45 pm
Sean Purcell says:
Jay,
I am in complete agreement with you in so far as NAR, assinine and get a clue go together. I commented on another post that the NAR’s focus is on protecting itself and not the members. This ends up being the raison d’etre of most such “trade” groups.
My point here is only about the rules of the club that we join (whether we like it or not).
>And if you check a large portion of agent sites have “mls” in their URL’s somewhere in their websites… I have no problem with anybody operating in today’s reality versus observing the policy to better serve the public
This is a very slippery slope my friend. Everyone else is doing it and since it is what I perceive to be best, it is OK.
My dad taught me something a long time ago:
“The great atrocities in history were not perpetrated by men of evil. But rather varying opinions on what is right.” No one wakes up in the morning and says I am going to do evil to others. They just decide that what they see as right IS right.”
March 11, 2008 — 3:56 pm
Jay Thompson says:
Sevierville RE wrote: “I may be mistaken but does NAR own the term MLS?”
No, they do not.
From my NARWisdom.com post that Russell linked to:
“I need some clarity on how they are able to do what they are doing.”
Because they make “the rules”…
March 11, 2008 — 4:14 pm
Jay Thompson says:
“to inhibit a Realtor while other companies are using the term and will continue to use the term (both as a meta tag and as part of the URL)?”
And in the ultimate irony, realtor.com, “The Official Site of the NAR”, uses the term “MLS” in its meta tags.
March 11, 2008 — 4:18 pm
Tony Pomykala says:
Guys, Thomas Johnson is giving you all one valuable hint. On your website you CAN write a short blurb about your favorite Major League Soccer team (MLS). That’s how you keep MLS in your Search Engine terms – being in your content.
Jay is absolutely right. We pay a membership to belong to our MLS, to be able to display actual MLS (albiet IDX versions) listings. Every listing has the actual MLS logo on it. So yes, they are MLS listings. We are granting access to those MLS listings, on every Realtor web site. We pay for that priviledge, and our potential clients benefit from that access. Here’s the rub: If we say those aren’t actual MLS listings, aren’t we lying?
So why shouldn’t we say they are MLS listings, as long as we don’t say we ARE the MLS then there is NO fraudulent action committed.
To NAR:
Reality is this: Someone WILL own those “MLS” domains. That’s a fact, they are too valuable. You can only control us Realtors, not the general public. So who would you rather have owning them, fellow members who answer to you, or the Joe Public who will abuse the domain and sell the leads from them back to us anyway? I think the answer should be obvious.
March 11, 2008 — 4:29 pm
Gary Ashton says:
Well…I’ve been embroiled in this issue for a bout 4 weeks now.
I am the exclusive realtor for http://www.Nashville.com and http://www.NashvillesMLS.com The NAR code of ethics change may have some intent to protect the public from websites passing them selves off as the official city MLS board but the case ruling 12 20 is being interpreted as a blanket prohibition of the use of MLS in a real estate related url.
The problem is that NAR views the term MLS as an official organization providing realtors with information about listings, listing activity, commissions, tax records etc. They feel that telling the public that they can “search the MLS” is misleading as that, im their minds, means the public will think they have access to all the MLS data.
In truth the term MLS has become recognized by the house buying public as meaning homes listed for sale by realtors. This is much the same as FSBO in that the public recognize this as meaning homes available for sale not listed by realtors.
NashvillesMLS.com is clearly not flying under the radar as an official MLS site. Even the President of my local MLS board has no problems with the intent of my site. My site is close to becoming a disclaimer site!
The person bring about the ethics violation complaint against me is in fact another realtor. His son is involved with SEO and was for the last 4 years webmaster/realtor for another online competitor. I can only leave the readers to draw their own conclusions as to the intent behind the complaint. Out of close to 90,000 unique visitors for 2007 no one else has ever complained.
This ruling has opened the door for 3rd party vendors to utilize the term MLS and then market the site, generate leads and sell the leads back to realtors. There is something fundamentally wrong with this. Realtors in some markets will not be able to use a term that is widely accepted by the public as meaning homes for sale.
In basic terms it’s a restraint of trade imposed upon the realtor at the national level by NAR. They are passing the buck down to the local level and leaving it open to interpretation of the ethics review board.
This means that some boards will rule against realtors with MLS in their URL and some will rule for them. All very confusing and basically helping to create discontent amongs its members and leaves the public scrathing their heads.
Lets hope that the site http://www.FreeTheMLS.com gets more and more exposure before realtors find that the are banned from using a phrase they themselves popularized and previously had made their own.
The NAR needs to take time to rethink the original intent behind the ruling and consider the long term benefit of it’s members.
March 11, 2008 — 5:34 pm
Athol Kay says:
It’s daft as all get out. Most blogs use the long titles as part of the URLs for individual post pages. Meaning if you write a post and use “MLS” in the title, then “MLS” shows up as part of the URL. There is simply no way to police that… even if policing that was less than completely retarded in the first place.
March 11, 2008 — 5:45 pm
DB says:
The way I understand trademarks, the name MLS is not an official trademark in the United States except as it applies to Major League Soccer. Then again, I could be wrong about that.
As for obxmls, NAR has a case as I can see how people would think they are going to the official OBX MLS site after seeing that url in the search engine, but I would think at the same time, as big as the outer banks are that no one broker could carry the entire listings for the whole OBX. Had it been a site say GregSwannsMLS, I do not think Nar would have much of an argument as it would be obvious that the site belongs to a specific Realtor.
As a fellow North Carolinian, I also find it insulting. I can see where NAR would think we would first think we are visiting the official OBX MLS site, but at the same time, while a lot of us North Carolinians may be poor and still do not have the Internet, I thing those of us who do have enough sense to realize once we click the url that the site belongs to a specific Realtor and is not the official OBX MLS.
The only people I see getting pissed off is the other OBX area Realtors. They are afraid because of the name Bill has an advantage over them due to his domain name. I can understand that but at the same time, the domain itself can be overcome. I started a real estate blog while in real estate school as a way of studying and before I got my license, my site was a lot popular than 95% of the real estate sites in my area including the Greenville NC MLS site (and it still is even through I do not have anything to do with real estate anymore.)
March 11, 2008 — 7:20 pm
Bob in San Diego says:
Thanks to NAR, buying MLS domains has become a growth industry.
March 11, 2008 — 8:16 pm
Ed Daniels - Metrowest Boston says:
Just reading thru all the exhaustive comments and insights about this topic can keep you busy! 9 years ago I got threatened by a fellow agent to not use Massachusetts MLS on my site because he “copywrited” it. I was amazed, shocked and in turn ignored the warning (aka sue me) but came to realize that an issue could brew out there on the topic. Keep up the battle, but I need to go and sell a few properties. After that I will get the law degree to come fight the battle with you!
March 11, 2008 — 8:36 pm
Michael says:
I’m a local Outer Banks realtor who does not use “MLS” in their website, and personally don’t care if anyone does. To be quite frank with the audience, without really reading into the regulations or having a full grasp of the legalities (for now), I can only think, “what does common sense think about this.” Now if someone is using the word “Official” in conjunction with “Outer Banks MLS” than that is outright misleading and could be an issue…OBVIOUSLY.
Maybe we take a pole in someway and find out how the public perceives the term “MLS.” In a couple different ways to get a realistic understanding, of course. I would guess that almost everyone would say in general terms that the MLS “is a place to look for listings, everyone has one on their website.” If then, you were to asked for an opinion to some pollsters on an even more specific term like “Outer Banks MLS”, and get there response, I would find it hard to believe that a majority would think it is THE MLS, and that they could not get all the same listings on a different site. It perceived as a general term. How the public is damaged in using this term, especially with in your face disclosures, is beyond common logic. ESPECIALLY when a Realtor is using it. Let’s be real folks. Realtors ARE the MLS. It’s shameful that time and energies are wasted on policing this rule when it is so far out of text or blatantly disclosed. It should be policed, but if it ain’t quackin‘, don‘t shoot it! Give me a break…SHAME ON YOU!!!! Besides, does MLS mean? Cripes, MLS is used by more than one association you know. I am beginning to wonder if someone legally has the trademark. Why chase a couple Realtor without just cause, when you can go after a mammoth of the MLS (That’s Major League Soccer (MLS), or is it Mass Layoff Statistics (MLS)…hmmmmm? I’d go after Major League Soccer. There’s more money in one place with that…..besides, why feed on the flesh of our own. Isn’t that cannibalism? That we know, is against the law.
March 11, 2008 — 9:52 pm
DB says:
Michael: To be honest with you, I doubt if 90% of the population in North Carolina even knows what the MLS stands for. It took me a good 3 or 4 months after I got my real estate license to even realize what the MLS stood for. It was never mentioned in real estate school and being inactive, I didn’t have a broker telling me what it meant or that it was something that I needed to join.
It wasn’t until I started my broker’s class that I finally realized after seeing my classmates updating their listings that I realized what the MLS stood for.
Heck, I didn’t even realize for nearly two years after they started printing them oval white OBX stickers what OBX stood for.
I think Jay Thompson is to credit for teaching me what NAR stood for.
Another thing I find odd is all these newspapers talking about how you need to hire a Realtor. Most people do not realize the difference between a regular real estate agent and a Realtor. For most, a real estate agent is a Realtor (thinking once you get your license you are a Realtor not realizing that to be a Realtor you have to join a trade association), so when they see newspaper articles taking about how to get your house sold and how you need to hire a Realtor, to most people, it’s basically saying – just go pick a real estate agent off the street.
Of course, it’s probably a good thing most North Carolinians do not know the difference as history has shown that we’re not very friendly when it comes to trade associations.
March 12, 2008 — 12:37 am
Tony Arko says:
This type of rule change, made be individuals who seem to have no idea of the implications of the rules they force upon us, is another example of why the majority of the members of all the committees of NAR need to be replaced. The other example of NAR leadership being out of touch with reality is the ridiculous print advertising campaign they keep wasting money on. The CEO of VAR told me on Monday that the only way to change the organization is from the inside out. Agents who actually understand the new world of Real Estate and RE 2.0 need to step up and support needs to be organized for these representatives.
March 13, 2008 — 12:03 pm
Russell Shaw says:
Tony, Actually I don’t agree that the majority of committee members need to be replaced. A group of “fully in touch” Realtors isn’t standing by to take their place. For the most part they toil long hours at a thankless job. If anything, we each owe them thanks for the good that they do. There are many issues that NAR committee members deal with – not just the ones we happen to not like what they did. The solution to them being out of touch is not replacing them but to get them in touch. That is happening.
March 15, 2008 — 8:12 pm
Tony Pomykala says:
Russell,
You are absolutely right, and it is really a great thing that you pointed that out. It’s so easy for us to get worked up in an emotional issue like this and forget what accomplishments they have acheived on our behalf. The logical method of fixing this mess, as you’ve pointed out, is educating everyone that needs to be educated, in a calm persuasive voice. The more voices, the more momentum and eventually the issue will (I hope) be corrected. Heck, there shouldn’t be anyone better at negotiating than us anyway, if we’re good REALTORs, right? LOL
March 15, 2008 — 8:27 pm
Robin says:
I am reading all of your old posts this evening and I can’t get enough..Thank you
May 19, 2008 — 8:33 pm
Jay Valento - Long Beach real estate says:
What a bunch of baloney….over three letters. I think NAR should be focused on something else more productive that this…
September 17, 2008 — 8:43 pm